[PvE] Justicar Tank Build

Discussion in 'Game Discussion' started by Acina, Feb 22, 2011.

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    Acina Admin Officer

    Hey folks, I've been working on a Justicar tanky build and have so far come up with this:

    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=10Grn.Vg.EuosqeckRR.Mcd

    I've taken all the usual abilities and stat increasing options. Only 8 points up the Shaman tree as I wanted Glacial Shield (extra defensive buff etc), 10% increased healing, 3% reduced damage and 2% melee crit (tempted to spend the remaining 2 points here to bump it upto 4%). Ignoring the melee abilities you gain as they only grant small % heals from your Justicar buffs (for the moment, although Fated and Massive Blow are very nice abilities), you gain Vengeance of the Winter Storm (more melee damage = more threat) and Courage of the Jaguar (40 Dex buff for all party/raid members at lvl 50).

    The Purifier tree is pretty nice it gives another shield (defensive buff), 5% more wisdom (converted to mana, spellpower and focus - all of which get converted to tank/melee stats by Faith in Action) and increased armor. Ofc you also get a small heal cheap heal for OOC when you don't have conviction (healing flame - aprox 230hp heal at lvl 50) an out of combat rez (always useful), endurance buff (40 Endurance at lvl 50) and ofc Cauterize (handy to be able to remove debuffs from yourself rather than being reliant on a healer).

    I have 2 remaining points at lvl 50, as yet need to see how mana starved we get, as I'm leveling through I'll probably spend points in Healers Creed and possibly Commitment, to reduce mana starvation - although still not sure here. Pass on where to stick those 2 points at 50, I'm tempted to stick 1 in Healing Blessing (Purifier tree) for some self heal on damage taken goodness or put both points in Unyielding to increase my melee crit by 2%.

    What are your thoughts?
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    Acina Admin Officer

    2011-02-22_125321.jpg

    Screengrab of build plus Character Stats window.
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    Akhalur Community Member

    I will be using these builds for PvE :
    Cabalist AoE range Pull
    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=10orn.VzV.VuRsVee.med00M

    Inquisitor DoT pull + 2 Armor
    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=10drn.Vxkb.VuksVej.med00M

    Warden Docturine Heal , anti cc + Extra mana
    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=10ern.xx0z.VuRsVee0o.med00M

    Hey m8 , i spent all my B7 time with justicar tanking on both PvE and PvP.Maybe i can help you.

    -You need "Commitment" , and "Endless winter" for sure.

    -When we were in DD and some other instances , it sometimes become impossible to regen that much mana only with Purpose. You will need Ageless ice as well. Most of aoe packs i found myself spamming Even Justice which is very high mana needed.

    -On the other hand "Docturine of Valiance" is abit more for Justicar Dps spec. Incoming heal is low according to how much mana you use for that spell.
    -Light Makes Right is another dps ability for chain spamming Docturine of Valiance which is not neede for tanking.
    -Absolution, Reprieve, Humility , Forced to Kneel and Supremacy is not needed for PvE "for now".
    -Hammer of Virtue. Im sure Justicar tank wont need 5% extra aggro from melee abilities since our best taunt skill is a Spell also we can combine more spells for aggro gain. Thanks to Mein of Leadership.

    -Another thing is when your party have a high amount of dps , you wont have a good ability to pull more mobs which are spread to each other. Also Protection of the ancestors only takes 1-2 hits from bosses and you wont generate aggro as Glacial Shield does.

    " Flame Ward" is proccing from offheals but 7 talents for 6% armor is abit much and that 6% armor only buffs your raw armor bonus which is coming from items not from other buffs.

    If i were you i would try Warden as a healer soul for extra mana % which will give you extra mana from Blocking or Reactive buffs, Also for instant range pulling with waterjet . Dissolution and Cleansing water are other anticc abilities . Also i managed to chainpull more mobs with Crushingwave which spell is also good interrupt spell.

    You can also give a chance for Inquisitor which gives you excellent multi pack pull ability as Vex ( talented ) , Extra armor or endurance with Armor of Devotion and Armor Of Treachery and also Range slow , kite ability which i used "alot " and spammable Impede , one more mana regain abilit as Agressive renewal and my best CC ability as Purge. Also pulling everything and hitting a souldrain is making aggro more than anything.
    Perserverance is very important anticc spell for anyt ank class.and since Souldrain is very close combat skill talented/untalented is very strong for holding aggro.

    Oh also i couldnt try out high level cabalist/justicar build for PvE coz of lurking decay bug. But Sigil of power , Tyranny and Bound fate is very important aoe pull spells imo.
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    Acina Admin Officer

    I'm not sure I want to go that far up the Shaman tree tbh (endless winter at 2/2 requires 17 point spend in Shaman) and I like the oh shite buttons we get at 38 and 44 points in the Justicar tree - these are useful for PvE will learning the Expert level stuff (if you can avoid a wipe) and a must have for PvP (until you get high enough rank to use the top tier Templar talents).

    In regard to Absolution, Reprieve, Humility, FtK and Supremacy my PvP head was thinking :p although I'm loath to get rid of a combat rez (Absolution) and a a sizeable oh shite heal (Reprieve) again for either wipe recovery or wipe prevention.

    So keeping this in mind I've dropped down to 38 points in Justicar (while i was unhappy to lose the 50% increased healing, I don't want to drop the 2k+ damage absorb - Just Defense).

    Again a valid point, Purifier looked good, but the point spend is too high for the gain.

    Honestly didn't think of this as an option, the 2/4/6/8/10% extra mana didn't compute when I looked at it, as its not a base stat increase (Wisdom preferably) I admittedly overlooked it.

    With a 11 point spend in Warden you can get the mana return abilities in Shaman very easily - will definitely play around with this build on Live:

    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=10ern.E00z.quosVee0oo.Vjd00M

    I'll look into the Inquisitor and Cabalist builds.
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    Acina Admin Officer

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    Aspira Admin Officer

    How is the Justi tank?

    I tried it in one of the betas but could never get it to flow right, always seemed like it was on a cooldown or waiting for something to proc. You guys getting some decent fluidity out of the build ?
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    Acina Admin Officer

    It was fairly shite, they've changed it in the last 2 betas (and alpha prior to that), most people that generally play tanks in MMO's are commenting that its a lot of fun in comparison to Warrior Soul tanking. Only problem I foresee for Justicar tanks is that none of the mail (or cleric shields for that matter) is itemised for tanking - yes we get passive buffs that convert all the caster stats to melee stats, but we are limited by talents to certain amounts of mitigation (Block for example).

    As far as fluidity, so far not had any real problems with rotations - that is the thing you build conviction up with SoJ (although there are other abilities that you can use) its the most efficient. and you'll find that you permanently have conviction if your hitting something.
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    Aspira Admin Officer

    Yea, I tried out Shammy DPS and Inquisitor DPS on the alpha and I had the same feeling about them as you have pointed out here about the Justicar.

    The tanking is good on Justicar and the DPS on Shammy and Inquis is good, but without itemised gear, how will it really compare at endgame ?

    Anyways, your tank build looks quite nice dude, I was playing mine in beta along with Druid to get the extra spell power to melee attack increase and also the Oak Shield, but tbh, this one you have put up looks a lot nicer to play.
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    Acina Admin Officer

    Yeh, i started out with the druid tree, but have gone off it there is far too much variety that can be added to the standard Justicar/Shaman builds, currently swaying towards Inquisitor due to Armor of Devotion and the spell pulls etc.

    Here is the in-game SS of the Just/Sham/Inq build I'm fiddling with, so you can see the character stats (full self-buffed):

    2011-02-22_170521.jpg

    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=10rnd.quosVee0oo.VId.Vxkb

    I know I've dropped 'Endless Winter' from the Shaman tree but I've gained a mana regen ability from the Inquisitor tree :)
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    Aspira Admin Officer

    I tried the Cabalist spell pull in Alpha and it pulls enemies to your target, not your target to you. I imagined it being Engineer/Magus ability from warhammer but it's actually really weak and pointless.

    Thing with Justicars that I like is that currently, there is no 51 point cookie cutter build for them forcing you to put more than 36 points into Justicar. This gives you much more freedom that the other Cleric builds whose bonuses after 36points are too silly not to go for.

    It's this freedom in the Justicar build creation that I like, hope it stays.
  11. Offline

    Acina Admin Officer

    I have to agree with this, while you get a few nice situational talents past 36 points there is nothing forcing you to go upto 51 points. I do like the 38 and 44 point abilities tho - but at present mana consumption will be an issue that means you can justifiably go that far in the tree (yet), as you need a certain amount of points in other souls to help regen/regain mana.
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    Akhalur Community Member

    Hello guys just arrived at home,

    Acina i see 1200 Parry rating in your character sheet. I really wonder if Parry or Block has roll on combat checks. If its Parry first , Mana gain on block is really pointles at some point. But if its Block first you can manage massive pulls alone with neverending mana.
    We need to check this in live combat.Theres some situations i really wonder:

    1-Maelstrom on their melee : If this pulls random first 5 people , its dodgy if you pull high amount of melee dps.( It was dodgy in WAR i was needing very high amount of survival after rifting people with my magus.)
    2.Maelstorm on healer + dump aoe silence+dps spells. This will be a total win but you need to charge backline which is more doable with Justicar+Cabalist.
    3.Maelstorm on Sieges , gank times : This is dogy also if you pull more Npc's than pc's
    4.Maelstrom on PvE as main Tank : This is like mass pull for DK or Templar ? That should be very powerfull aoe tank abilty if you combo it with justicar aoe Taunt.

    I really impressed how i tanked dungeons and Rift even invasion boss including Asmos dpsing on me. I rvr tanked before with Blackorc and Blackguard in WAR and ended using Nerfed buttons for better rotations. Macroing is very easy in Rift and helps alot.

    For itemisation youre definately right and since some of us you and me and maybe more people wants tanking as cleric we need to pick 1 guy and get proffession resources for that guy to make us Shields or Armor. I couldnt find any single Shield dropping from quests after 12 i guess. We definately need alot of spellpower for Stalwart citadel and Devout deflection this means we can hold aggro more with damaging spells than melee abilities.

    For Conviction cycling with Docturine of Valiance , I believe thats pure dps stat for Justicars. Also i made a build for only Justicar Dpsing that ill post link later.

    I believe gear is already itemised for us without counting oh shite buttons lets see what we have :

    Justicar:
    Devout Deflection : Spellpower
    Stalwart Citadel : Spellpower
    Bolt Of Radiance :Spellpower - Life Damage
    Sovereignity : Spellpower - Life Damage
    Censure : Meleepower -Life Damage
    Even Justice : Meleepower - Life Damage
    Strike of Judgement : Meleepower - Life Damage

    Inquisitor :
    Vex : Spellpower ( Talented Vex with mass dotting mobs, enemies gives you huge amount of survival.) - Death Damage
    Sanction Heretic :Spellpower - Life Damage - Procs Conviction -?? Procs more with dot ticks from Light makes Right.-Good Burst application damage.
    Inner Focus : Inquisitor filler for first tree :Spellcrit
    SoulDrain : Very huge damage and good aggro skill - Spellpower - Death Damage

    Sentinel :
    Life's Vengeance - Spellpower - Life Damage
    Banish -Spellpower - Life Damage

    Warden :
    Waterjet : Spellpower - Water Damage
    Crushing Wave - Spellpower - Water Damage
    Drown : Spell Power - Water Damage very good Combo with Interdict and knock backs.

    Oh btw i tried Crushing Wave + Excommunicate on same target it just throws target miles away.

    So thers 2 options for filler skills.
    1 - Using CD's and filling gaps with Strike of Judgement > You will need again Spell power but also , Hammer Of Virtue.(5 more talent)
    2 - Using CD's and filling gaps with Water Jet > You just need Spellpower.

    Also you can conver Spell stats to Melee but you cant convert melee stats to Spell os i believe Unless you go for pure melee dps , you just need to pump spell stats which current dropped items already have.

    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=10nar.Exdz0Ms.VV.EuMooccz

    This build is for Justicar mdps , cycling more Convictions and spamming them , morely for supporting group with conviction spams with free talent spots you can go more for Justicar or more Shaman
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    Akhalur Community Member

    For PvP
    Lets compare Waterjet vs Strike of Judgement

    WaterJet :

    Instant
    0-30 range.
    Banefits from Destructive Tide (Warden) , Inquisitor (Inner Focus)
    No weapon requirement.
    Water Damage


    Strike of Judgement:
    Melee range
    Benefits from Hammer of Virtue (Justicar) , Shaman and Druid melee buff abilities.
    Melee weapon requirement
    Life Damage ( Procs Conviction )

    Docturines are really not spammable spells , they are for healing you , your ally or mandante . You always have full docturines by cycling Life based skill cd's (Even Justice gives 1 Conviction) so It really doesnt matter whatever is your main spam button. Also dont forget Clerics dont have any "Charge" abilities to catch fleeing people or kiters ; rather than that we can spam them with out range spell Waterjet.

    Btw all docturine spells are getting bonus from "on Single heal","on direct heal" and "heal boost" talents.
  14. Offline

    Acina Admin Officer

    @Akhalur I'll be doing Armoursmithing/Mining/Butchery crafting wise, i managed to level them up quite quickly as I leveled in the beta's.
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    Akhalur Community Member

    so i wont get any crafting skill, just gona get gathering ones and spam your mail :D
  16. Offline

    Aspira Admin Officer

    @Acina @Akhalur If you like we could pick crafts between us so we can keep ourselves going.

    Armor/Weapons/Gatherings to match. Upto you guys but would keep us clerics tooled up.
  17. Offline

    Akhalur Community Member

    Yeah would be very cool I prefer you two get the Craftings and i can get 2 gathering source . I guess Shield is armorsmithing ? in Auction house it was under weapons but i really dont know.
  18. Offline

    Acina Admin Officer

    Well I'm kinda forcing Azriella to take Apothecary/Foraging/Artificer - mainly for the pots, but they seem to work well with my choices :)
  19. Offline

    Acina Admin Officer

    Yeh, shields are Armoursmithing :)
  20. Offline

    Acina Admin Officer

    And by force I apparently mean I'll be leveling them on her character for her [IMG]

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